Hard launch transmission disengages

[21booSTedExplorer]

Shouldn't you be using a Livernois ethanol tune? As far as I know, the Livernois device can datalog but not sure how you would read the file. Maybe only they can make read it.

Yes, I apologize if the way I said it wasn't clear. I was on a Livernois 93 stage 4 tune while running 93 and the Livernois E30 stage 4 tune when I ran E30 fuel.

 

[Stone17]

If you can catch it on a datalog that’ll be the best way to figure it out.
And Level 10 has been hit or miss lately…

I had a Level 10 in my Dodge Magnum SRT 8 (650 HP to the rear wheel). The tranny lasted about 10 months.

 

[Cdubya]

Yes, I apologize if the way I said it wasn't clear. I was on a Livernois 93 stage 4 tune while running 93 and the Livernois E30 stage 4 tune when I ran E30 fuel.

Then, you have a point. You should be seeing more of a difference with E30. Maybe open a ticket with Livernois to ask. And while you are at it, ask them to have the gear displayed always.

 

[I Bleed Ford Blue]

Yes, I apologize if the way I said it wasn't clear. I was on a Livernois 93 stage 4 tune while running 93 and the Livernois E30 stage 4 tune when I ran E30 fuel.

Maybe it's time to ditch the livernois tune and get a good one from ZFG. The 93 tune from ZFG will accept E-0 up to E-30, no need for a separate tune. Earlier this summer with an E-25 mix in the tank and just an intercooler and the zfg tune and heavy ass 22's on the ST and a D/A of 1372' I ran a 12.52@109 and a 4.15 0-60.

 

[Cdubya]

Maybe it's time to ditch the livernois tune and get a good one from ZFG. The 93 tune from ZFG will accept E-0 up to E-30, no need for a separate tune. Earlier this summer with an E-25 mix in the tank and just an intercooler and the zfg tune and heavy ass 22's on the ST and a D/A of 1372' I ran a 12.52@109 and a 4.15 0-60.

You do know you posted similar numbers to his LMS 93 run? Bottom line, shouldn't E30 (or E25 for that matter) get better performance than 93 octane?

Another question: shouldn't your custom ZFG tune with E25 get much better results than his canned LMS 93 tune?

 

[I Bleed Ford Blue]

He has more mods than I do, I have the heavy 22's on and the D/A was 1372'. With fall and cooler temps finally getting here, I'll put my winter setup on and try again. I should see around a 12.20 to 12.30 with just an intercooler and a tune.

 

[Cdubya]

He has more mods than I do, I have the heavy 22's on and the D/A was 1372'. With fall and cooler temps finally getting here, I'll put my winter setup on and try again. I should see around a 12.20 to 12.30 with just an intercooler and a tune.

His first 93 octane drag just had intercooler and filter. Why his other mods didn't net any benefits is a mystery.

 

[I Bleed Ford Blue]

That's why I think it's the cheap canned tune from livernois.

 

[TMac]

His first 93 octane drag just had intercooler and filter. Why his other mods didn't net any benefits is a mystery.

That's why I think it's the cheap canned tune from livernois.

A tune can't magically just take advantage of mods. For example, with better exhaust flow, you might see the same torque at a slightly lower RPM because of less backpressure. Or, you might see more consistency with an intercooler since it's not pulling timing or boost, but that's about it. Otherwise you'd be asking for algorithms that are constantly trying to maximize torque by attempting to increase boost and timing over the maps. Not that it couldn't be done, but it's not being done by Ford. Because, if it were, you'd never need a tune!

 

[21booSTedExplorer]

Maybe it's time to ditch the livernois tune and get a good one from ZFG. The 93 tune from ZFG will accept E-0 up to E-30, no need for a separate tune. Earlier this summer with an E-25 mix in the tank and just an intercooler and the zfg tune and heavy ass 22's on the ST and a D/A of 1372' I ran a 12.52@109 and a 4.15 0-60.

I sent him an email with some questions last week and again a few days ago and have yet to hear back. Not sure if the contact link isn't working since it sounds like Adam has a great customer service reputation. Ken Kyle Racing on YouTube has a few less mods and is running between 11.6 and 12.0 on ZFG's E50 tune depending on weather conditions and rolling the dice on getting a good launch with a brake boost (there is no excuse for Ford to not have launch control on the ST). I would expect to be at least there with a ZFG tune as well.

His first 93 octane drag just had intercooler and filter. Why his other mods didn't net any benefits is a mystery.

I feel like LMS is a great option for a tune only vehicle. They're 93 tune paired with a bigger intercooler is respectable if that's all you're looking to get out of it. Since they really don't do custom remote tuning once you start adding boltons they are negated by the limits of the "one size fits all" tuning style. I'm not badmouthing Livernois by any means I just feel like my goals have outgrown the use for their tune. They have already outright told me until they release their own HPFP they will not tune beyond E30 so they are setting their own limitations for whatever reason they have to do that.

 

[FORZDA3]

You do know you posted similar numbers to his LMS 93 run? Bottom line, shouldn't E30 (or E25 for that matter) get better performance than 93 octane?

Another question: shouldn't your custom ZFG tune with E25 get much better results than his canned LMS 93 tune?

A 93 tune is set for 93, but Adam gives it enough freedom to add enough fuel (20-30%) through the trims to safely run the E25. It isn’t “tuned” for E25.

If you ARE tuned for say E50 specifically, a fully stock car, tune only, will in fact run 12.1 @ 114, and into the 11s with just a bit of prep to the car like cleaning out all the junk and less than full fuel in the tank.

Ask Liver for an E50 tune and see what you get. I really like to tune myself, but Adam ZFG has the most experience and success with the 3.0 TTEB.

 

[ridered74]

I sent him an email with some questions last week and again a few days ago and have yet to hear back. Not sure if the contact link isn't working since it sounds like Adam has a great customer service reputation. Ken Kyle Racing on YouTube has a few less mods and is running between 11.6 and 12.0 on ZFG's E50 tune depending on weather conditions and rolling the dice on getting a good launch with a brake boost (there is no excuse for Ford to not have launch control on the ST). I would expect to be at least there with a ZFG tune as well.

I feel like LMS is a great option for a tune only vehicle. They're 93 tune paired with a bigger intercooler is respectable if that's all you're looking to get out of it. Since they really don't do custom remote tuning once you start adding boltons they are negated by the limits of the "one size fits all" tuning style. I'm not badmouthing Livernois by any means I just feel like my goals have outgrown the use for their tune. They have already outright told me until they release their own HPFP they will not tune beyond E30 so they are setting their own limitations for whatever reason they have to do that.

Full disclosure, that 11.69 was with the two rear seats removed and spare tire removed. Quickest full weight pass was 11.82 but I've never done a full max rpm launch yet.

I'm a bit jaded against Livernois from my past experiences, but if I was advising someone using their tune, I would recommend before spending money on any other mods, best bang for the buck would 100% be switching to ZFG.

It's really hard comparing 1/4 times without knowing launch rpm. It'd be great to get a thread of various tuners 1/4 times where every single launch was from idle. Mine is usually around 12.5 from idle.

 

[21booSTedExplorer]

Full disclosure, that 11.69 was with the two rear seats removed and spare tire removed. Quickest full weight pass was 11.82 but I've never done a full max rpm launch yet.

I'm a bit jaded against Livernois from my past experiences, but if I was advising someone using their tune, I would recommend before spending money on any other mods, best bang for the buck would 100% be switching to ZFG.

It's really hard comparing 1/4 times without knowing launch rpm. It'd be great to get a thread of various tuners 1/4 times where every single launch was from idle. Mine is usually around 12.5 from idle.

I haven't done one from idle since I was 93 tune and intercooler only. I want to say it was right around 13 flat. I typically hear spooling just over 2000rpm and if I launch over 2600rpm it usually breaks traction and wheelhops. I try for as close to 2400rpm as possible and I feel like I'm getting a good consistency as far as my 60ft.

 

[Fst4g63]

I had a Level 10 in my Dodge Magnum SRT 8 (650 HP to the rear wheel). The tranny lasted about 10 months.

I am surprised it lasted that long. Level 10 is a trash company that can not even do factory rebuilds. They took the units from our cars and in some cases shipped them back never opened. They have a long history of jumping onto new platforms snatching money and going to the next one. My customers and myself only used Pure Drivetrain Solutions now, if that helps any future projects.

 

[DetroitST]

This same thing happens a couple times a month to me as well on ZFG's tune. I always immediately paddle up and take foot off gas. Definitely something slipping in transmission. Especially coming out of a hairpin turn if I floor it at 5-10mph it will almost always slip and bounce the rev limiter. I just drive around it and try not to aggravate the car by doing something I know it doesn't like.

 

[Cdubya]

This same thing happens a couple times a month to me as well on ZFG's tune. I always immediately paddle up and take foot off gas. Definitely something slipping in transmission. Especially coming out of a hairpin turn if I floor it at 5-10mph it will almost always slip and bounce the rev limiter. I just drive around it and try not to aggravate the car by doing something I know it doesn't like.

That's just it... stock or tuned, it's something that happens once in while. I for one cannot reproduce it at will. Unless you happen to capture it while datalogging, who knows what the root cause is.

 

[Hot wifes ST]

So after chatting with ZFG about tuning we are going to do what it takes to log the event with the LMS data logger and see what it shows. We don't like to beat on our ST's to much but have been able to reproduce the event. I'm just fishing here but both our 2022 ST's do these and we did not have this issue with 2021's and my husband and I are wondering about the calibration change with the rear end breaking, our 21's were never updated and the 22's came with the up date? I really miss coming out of the hole and seeing low 4 sec 0 to 60 times..

 

[singingwhodat]

It happens to me quite often as well


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[Hot wifes ST]

Ok this is really becoming and issue for us we had both car's out today for some testing, we couldn't get the data logger to work and both ST's keep repeating the lunch issue. We are at a loose as to what's going any help would be appreciated. 2500 RPM WOT launch and when it comes out of first gear it falls on its face, we did not see this with our LMS 93 stage 4 tuning on our 2021's.

 

[TMac]

Ok this is really becoming and issue for us we had both car's out today for some testing, we couldn't get the data logger to work and both ST's keep repeating the lunch issue. We are at a loose as to what's going any help would be appreciated. 2500 RPM WOT launch and when it comes out of first gear it falls on its face, we did not see this with our LMS 93 stage 4 tuning on our 2021's.

Have you read the entire thread? What do you think anyone on this forum can tell you that they haven't already? Outside of @DetroitST looks like only Livernois tunes are having this problem. @21booSTedExplorer has a '21 so that wouldn't suggest only your '22s are suspect. You'll need to get a functional datalog to try to figure it out.

As I posted before, if this was a manual trans car, it would immediately be diagnosed as clutch slippage. Since it seems those who post the same symptoms are bumping off the rev-limiter, it could still be some type of torque-reduction strategy. If it is, it's in the TCU, not the ECU. There are so many things it could be, but it would seem to be centered on the trans.