Rear end damage

[C4talyst]

Hey guys, I'm putting something together to address this with Ford; may be class-action in nature. I'm going to need resources and expert opinion and will be reaching out to some of you privately.

For now, I was hoping someone would post a synopsis of why/how this is a (perhaps significant) safety issue. A simple breakdown of the possibilities should someone encounter a bolt failure at speed.

Will post more soon...thanks.

 

[Chrispw24]

Luckily I was only going about 40mph when it happened. It did freak my 8 year old daughter out. She busted out crying thinking we were in an accident. I’m sure this could be bad if traveling at highway speeds (85-90mph)!!

 

[C4talyst]

Luckily I was only going about 40mph when it happened. It did freak my 8 year old daughter out. She busted out crying thinking we were in an accident. I’m sure this could be bad if traveling at highway speeds (85-90mph)!!

Aside from the loss of power did you lose some amount of steering control?

 

[Chrispw24]

Aside from the loss of power did you lose some amount of steering control?

I don’t really know. The lane I was in turned into a turn lane which is where I stopped.

 

[UpinBst]

I don't think the 2.3 is a bad engine. It's not in the same league when it comes to moving a 4700 lb. vehicle down the road but these engines are no slouch either.

It's just a matter of preference for me. The 2.3 today is leaps and bounds from the 2.3 turbo in my first mustang 86 SVO way back when I was young buck and that's no where near being in the same playing field as today's technology. Coming from a background having boosted everything from pushrod small blocks, boosted modular 4.6's, 5.0's, 5.4's 2v, 3v, 4v the 2.3 in the explorer just didn't do it for me.

It felt ok at best getting up and going from a stop light, but once your up to speed it just doesn't have the passing nutz I like and overall felt much more sloppy and floaty going down the road. The Platnium had a much better ride quality and felt much more solid and had a reasonable amount of power as to be expected from a heavier vehicle. They are two completely different animals for different reasons and different people.

 

[Dark Knight]

So if I have the ghetto 1 bolt, I shouldn't tune?

 

[Chrispw24]

So if I have the ghetto 1 bolt, I shouldn't tune?

You can but it will probably break. Luckily firs will fix it with correct part

 

[ChefMAC283]

I will jump on a class action or at least group complaint with Ford, Dark Knight if you put something together. I was just installing Borla CF exhaust on mine today and saw the single bolt. I already have my 10/21 production with 1000 miles going in for a screen replacement on Wednesday for the flickering. This is why more people don't buy American made... because of the corners cut. I have been a BMW guy for 20 years and never a engineering issue ever. In fact everything is always over engineered, not under. If my rear end goes with my 10 month year old daughter in my ST, Ford will have something to answer for. Especially if they are made aware of the fault ahead of time.

 

[Clears]

I will jump on a class action or at least group complaint with Ford, Dark Knight if you put something together. I was just installing Borla CF exhaust on mine today and saw the single bolt. I already have my 10/21 production with 1000 miles going in for a screen replacement on Wednesday for the flickering. This is why more people don't buy American made, because of the corners cut. I have been a BMW guy for 20 years, never a engineering issue ever. everything is always over engineered, not under. If my rear end does with my 10 month year old daughter in my ST, Ford will have something to answer for. Especially if they are made aware of the fault ahead of time.

I'm right there with ya!

 

[Dark Knight]

they wont recall it til it breaks and people die

 

[ChefMAC283]

they wont recall it til it breaks and people die

Whoops I quoted the wrong person, I meant C4talyst.

 

[Fordman]

Count me in.

I bought a Ford Performance vehicle that Ford brags about the performance of and offers the ST Experience to show case it’s capabilities and then degrades the the axle mount so that it will break during performance driving???

Ford needs to step up and fix this!

 

[ChefMAC283]

Count me in.

I bought a Ford Performance vehicle that Ford brags about the performance of and offers the ST Experience to show case it’s capabilities and then degrades the the axle mount so that it will break during performance driving???

Ford needs to step up and fix this!

Ha, my dealers response

“I suggest you stay off the internet because if it were a problem then ford would have a recall”.

Well if I get into an accident because this things snaps and I brought this to their attention prior then I foresee a problem for ford in the future.


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[ChefMAC283]

Got a little more curious about something else here, and had to check the build tag on the subframe since I wanted to see the engineering number (which is different from the part number). On my ST which has the four differential bolts, the number on the tag is MLB5C-5B564-AA as shown below.

View attachment 8493

Interestingly enough, the engineering number for the base model subframe with the three bolts is the same, although the example I found below is from '19 (and before mine was built). Who knows, maybe Ford did decide at some point to make the change on all models, thinking it would save them some $$$. Ironically, if many of the vehicles come back with damage due to this, it will cost them a lot more in the long run. Still worth looking in to for those with the revised subframe.

View attachment 8494



The rear bolt(s) torque is 148 lb.ft. (200 Nm).

View attachment 8495

View attachment 8496

Where was that tag located, is it easy to see without putting the car on a lift?


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[Cdubya]

They replaced with the two rear bolt one!!

I wonder if this is proof that the ST should have come with the two bolt subframe but that they sub'd the one bolt of the 2.3L because it was backordered or just sheer mistake.

 

[ChefMAC283]

I wonder if this is proof that the ST should have come with the two bolt subframe but that they sub'd the one bolt of the 2.3L because it was backordered or just sheer mistake.

Yeah it would be helpful if people say what dealership they had this done at, or any information that is useful. Most dealers will just say they’ve never heard of any problems with it before. Well of course they haven’t, it seems to be isolated to the newest production models. Which means with a shortage of everything else in the world maybe they tried to cut a corner here and are now getting caught. Ford modo, wait for it to fail then we fix it.


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[jrgoffin]

Where was that tag located, is it easy to see without putting the car on a lift?


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Could be in many places. Mine was right n the middle above the two diff bolts, which was easy to see when I was changing out the sway bar. From the pictures I posted, looks like there may be several labels plastered all over them. Just have to get under and start looking.

Glad to see Ford is using the correct subframes as replacements. Hopefully they get on this and take care of customers. At least being on the internet helped here!

 

[Gantell]

If I remember correctly the introduction of the 2020 Explorer ran into big production issues and caused Ford sales to miss expectations. They wound up short 12,000 units. The shortfall was attributed in part due to problems with the conversion of the Chicago Assembly plant from front-wheel to rear-wheel drive. With all the pressure to get the line moving maybe a shortcut or two was taken?

 

[FORZDA3]

If I remember correctly the introduction of the 2020 Explorer ran into big production issues and caused Ford sales to miss expectations. They wound up short 12,000 units. The shortfall was attributed in part due to problems with the conversion of the Chicago Assembly plant from front-wheel to rear-wheel drive. With all the pressure to get the line moving maybe a shortcut or two was taken?

This is the most likely scenario. I know for s fact that Ford assembly lines will use any part that fits to keep the line moving. It happened on the Focus RS when it was released as well. Ford used the wrong head gasket which caused a later coolant leak an ultimate engine failure. There is/was a huge recall to fix the problem. The actions ranged from gasket only to full engine replacements.
I will never return a née car to the dealer unless last resort before selling it. I’ll fix any problems within(my) reason, including the rear subframe on my ST. I’m replacing the engine (adding mo’ powa’ too) in my RS as well.

 

[Chrispw24]

I wonder if this is proof that the ST should have come with the two bolt subframe but that they sub'd the one bolt of the 2.3L because it was backordered or just sheer mistake.

Seems that way. They for sure didn’t upgrade it out of the goodness of their heart